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West Armenia Or North Kurdistan?, Discussing the matter of land ownership...
DÓrÓ
post 04/22/07 02:25 PM
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Map from The Treaty of SŤvres:





Some questions to start the discussion:

1| Who inhabited these lands the last 200 years?

2| Who inhabits these lands now?

3| Who has legal rights to these lands?

4| Who legally owns these lands now?

5| What happened in these lands the last 100 years?



Before hand I would like to ask all trolls to bugger off to another thread... This thread is not a place for hate or rascism - nor am I going to tolerate any insults on any of the parts discussed...

Please be civil and polite...
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Mordoth
post 04/22/07 02:30 PM
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LEt me answer all ;

- Noone has the legal rights upon those lands but THE TURKS .Because the treaty is abandoned by another Treaty
called LAUSANNE .
icon_wink.gif

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Hosank
post 04/22/07 02:47 PM
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yes...

as you can clearly note on the pics you have placed....

the border of kurdistan is south of the lake van..which is an armenian holy city..

it is true that in the last 100 years, many kurds have come to live there.but that is because the turks forcemoved them to replace the armenians...

i am not against the kurds..but you have enough land entitled to you, why do you have to include our lands in your kurdistan?
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Ishkhan
post 04/22/07 02:49 PM
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Why would you go back only 200 years? Armenians have been living in these lands for thousands of years, more than anybody else. I think that the borders that were to be established with the Sevres treaty are pretty realistic.

Before we could do anything, we have to help Kurds.
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Hosank
post 04/22/07 02:51 PM
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help them go to their kurdistan, where they may live in peace with us..
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DÓrÓ
post 04/22/07 03:15 PM
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@ Hosank

The map is from the Treaty of SŤvres...

It's not what I personally want... It's what the Treaty of SŤvres said...

@Ishkhan

I said 200 years, because that, in my eyes, is enough to say somebody is entitled to ownership of land - if their family and forefathers lived there on those same land 200 years ago, then today they can say they are from these lands... 4-5 generations is a long time...

If you wish, we can talk about 1000 years ago... Wouldn't change anything if you look at the facts of the matter...


I will not speak of "more than anybody else" - because I think that is irrelevant to this discussion... There is evidence that both Kurds and Armenians have been living in this area (Mesopotamia) - for milleniums...

So a few hundred years more or less on one side is meaningless in my eyes... What is your oppinion on this?


But please, I would like you to answer my questions if possible...
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Ishkhan
post 04/22/07 05:05 PM
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Armenians have traditionally lived in the Armenian highland, while the Kurds lived in Northern Mesopotamia, next to the Assyrians.

Quite frankly I think that 200 years of history aren't enough. Land claims wouldn't be legitimate. For example, Mexican immigrants are augmenting in numbers today in the US. In 200 years, they can't simply say that the US is theirs.

Even 200 years ago, Kurds weren't an organized and united nation. For instance, a Kurd identified himself with his tribe (tribes even had names of their own) rather than with the whole Kurdish nation. That wasn't the case with the Armenians, and hasn't been so for thousands of years...

Historical aspects and treaties may seem important to us, but to the eyes of the international community, they aren't. If you're strong enough today, and if you control important resources and trade routes, everybody would want to come closer to you and would help you in your demands. If not, you're pretty much lost in the pages of history.

EDIT: Mordoth, Armenians and Kurds never officially signed or recognized the Lausanne Treaty. If they did, explain me how.
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Hosank
post 04/22/07 07:02 PM
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but the land north of van has never been part of the kurdish homeland, as it is that of the armenians, whos monuments fill have filled the country for millenia
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HayArsen
post 04/22/07 07:56 PM
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Its West Armenia. You helped turks do the dirty work, you burned raped Armenians, stole their property. I know you are sorry for what you have done but that doesn't mean that you get our lands
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Jam
post 04/22/07 09:50 PM
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QUOTE(HayArsen @ 04/22/07 07:56 PM) [snapback]107595[/snapback]
Its West Armenia. You helped turks do the dirty work, you burned raped Armenians, stole their property. I know you are sorry for what you have done but that doesn't mean that you get our lands


Yes the Kurds helped the Turks a lot. Turks gave the commands and prepared the genocide but Kurds probably killed more Armenians than Turks to get the Armenian land. Kurds had several big and small armies to hunt the Armenians down. Most Armenians around Van, Diyarbakir and Elaziz were murdered by Kurds. Now these Kurds claim that the whole Eastern Anatolia is Kurdistan. Before they build their Great Kurdish Empire they should leave the land of Armenians and Zazas. By the way you can see on their maps that Adana and Hatay which are on the Mediterranian Coast are Kurdish too icon_exclaim.gif icon_rolleyes.gif
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davit2
post 04/22/07 10:03 PM
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ok everyone in real life im davit i just forgot my password and i cant recover it so i started a new account just remeber that davit2 is davit and admim if you can help me with this problem about ma password for davit tell me aplease and athankyou.

yea and no one gonna take part of armenia or ill come and shoot ya all ill bring all my friends and homies and you all will die if you try to take my terrytory cockroaches.
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DÓrÓ
post 04/23/07 03:56 AM
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HayArsen and Davit, you're threats and insults are unwelcome...

Such language is not justified...


@HayArsen - I didn't kill anybody... Nor did my father or mother...

Nor have I ever heard of my grandfather or grandmother killing anybody...


@Jam - you are trying hard to make this into a fight - but I am going to tell you this one time: stop flaming - or I will have you out of here...

To everybody else: we are discussing - it's not a verbal or physical fight...

Either put up, or shut up... Anybody can be a cyber-warrior...


Now back to topic....

@Ishkhan

[img]Armenians have traditionally lived in the Armenian highland, while the Kurds lived in Northern Mesopotamia, next to the Assyrians.

Quite frankly I think that 200 years of history aren't enough. Land claims wouldn't be legitimate. For example, Mexican immigrants are augmenting in numbers today in the US. In 200 years, they can't simply say that the US is theirs.

Even 200 years ago, Kurds weren't an organized and united nation. For instance, a Kurd identified himself with his tribe (tribes even had names of their own) rather than with the whole Kurdish nation. That wasn't the case with the Armenians, and hasn't been so for thousands of years...

Historical aspects and treaties may seem important to us, but to the eyes of the international community, they aren't. If you're strong enough today, and if you control important resources and trade routes, everybody would want to come closer to you and would help you in your demands. If not, you're pretty much lost in the pages of history.

EDIT: Mordoth, Armenians and Kurds never officially signed or recognized the Lausanne Treaty. If they did, explain me how.[/img]

Yes, Armenians have traditionally lived north of lake Van... But that doesn't mean that it ever was explisitly Armenian... We have no proof that only Armenians lived there - in fact there is evidence that also Kurds lived there - along side Armenians...

Athough this map is from after the Genocide, I'd like to share it: http://www.anesi.com/rmap2.jpg

But this map here, is from 1896:

Kurds and Armenians lived in mixed areas as well as explisitly Kurdish and Armenians areas...

In this map you see where the Turks make the majority:



I think for Armenians to even have a slight chance at getting their hands on any of their ancient land, is if the land is in the hands of Kurds... Unlike the Turks, Kurds feel remorse for the Genocide and don't deny it happening - you're best chance would be the good will of a people with guilty consciene...

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DÓrÓ
post 04/23/07 04:13 AM
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By the way - MOST Kurds are VERY positive to the Armenians...

And here are a couple of examples:

http://kurdisharmenian.blogspot.com/

http://www.vivakurdistan.com/profile.asp?i...ername=Lawin_R-

And of course myself... icon_biggrin.gif
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Senharib
post 04/23/07 10:53 AM
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1| If we speak about today's Turkey. Then that land belongs to Assyrians and Armenians. These land have christian history from the days of Anatolia til now. Kurds are foreigners and should be removed in large numbers. You have NEVER been a majority to these areas until these last 100 years. Since the days of the genocide. You have gained your numbers through killing and raping christian Assyrians/Armenians.

2| Sadly moslem fanatic Kurds inhabit these lands with most numbers, which is a shame to these old hills and mountains. They bear a great history and they are know in hands of some occupying foreigners.

3| Assyrians have right to their own land which was stolen by Kurdish and Turkish ######. If we would get our land back then you Kurds would have to go back where you came from, back to Iran.

4| Fascist Turkish state owns these lands now. Kurds are only "existing" and taking place in these lands. Legally it belongs to the keepers of these lands, which are Assyrians from Mardin-Midyat and whole Turabdin area. The land closer to Armenian should get back to their rightfull owners aswell. We have churches that is thousands of years old. And in some of these villages it is only populated by moslem kurds?? How the hell can kurds have history in these lands when they live in a village that has a church which is older than Kurdish history?? Last time i checked, Kurds werent christans. Have never been and will never be!


5| I'll tell you what happened the last 100 years. Kurds have: Massacrated,killed, raped, slaughtered,forced,threathened, assimilated Assyrians.

That is your wonderful story these last decades!
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Senharib
post 04/23/07 10:58 AM
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"http://kurdisharmenian.blogspot.com/"

hahaha. ohyeeeaaaahh. Sure. Look at this site www.Assyriansofkurdistan.com

See any similarites?? Yeah both is KURDISH influenced and manipulated by KURDS! Both Bullshitted by Kurds!

You are a joke!
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Senharib
post 04/23/07 10:58 AM
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.
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DÓrÓ
post 04/23/07 11:16 AM
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Only joke here, is your hate... I will not sink to your level... Ta ta Mr. anger...
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Rumtaya
post 04/23/07 12:12 PM
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For me as an Assyrian, I stand with my Armenian Brothers, who faced a genocid by which their population where reduced to a minimum at the hand of some kurds and the turkish armee in their ancorst homeland of west Armenia.

It is hard to claim such a land today, because like said, there is no big armenian population left, still if Turkey will be in the future divided..those armenians who left should be able to return back...just like the Kurds are returning back to parts of northern iraq...especially Kirkuk....

Clear Statment....from Van up is ARMENIAN LAND...., I am sure there are some very important places for my hayastan brothers...., just like we have some very important places in northern Iraq....






TOGETHER WE STAND TALL





Kurdistan should be...mountainarea under van...northerneast IRak (mountain area) and west Iran....
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prot9999
post 04/23/07 01:22 PM
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Yours stupids still think same stupid dream? icon_lol.gif Rumtaya are you really serious? Can you fight against to us from Germany? Diri can fight from Norway? And other nothing guys can yours fight against Turkish Armenies?? I never think, yours just see dream, but impossible dream. icon_lol.gif

Kurds, Assyrians and Armenians yours are nothing. Yours will never stole any land from us. I'm sure yours now make masturbation with looking these stupid pictures. Your Abhazas!!! How much Assyrian soldier have? How much armenian can fight againt Turkish army? How much kurd can fight against Turkish Commandos? Be real do first!

Yours no any luck against Turkish Commandos. Anyone want try? Why yours living 5000 km later from Anatolia?

Kerkuk, Musul, Yerevan are Turkish cities and nearly time we will get back all. Look reals and keep your stupid dreams.

LOL Regards!


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Jam
post 04/23/07 01:42 PM
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QUOTE(DÓrÓ @ 04/23/07 03:56 AM) [snapback]107636[/snapback]
@Jam - you are trying hard to make this into a fight - but I am going to tell you this one time: stop flaming - or I will have you out of here...

Diri I'm not scared of you or any other guy. I'm just telling the truth. Kurds killed many Armenians and everybody knows that but if there is one nation which is guilty that must be the Turks. I will never be prokurdish till you all accept the Zaza nation. You guys put Armenian, Zaza and Assyrian lands into Kurdistan so it is natural that I do not like Kurds.

You don't want me here because you do not want the people to know the bad side of Kurdishness. There is no Kurdistan yet and I don't wanna imagine how other ethnic groups would live in Kurdistan. You are a Kurdish nationalist and everything what you want is a big Kurdistan correct me if I am wrong icon_idea.gif
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irlandahay
post 04/23/07 03:10 PM
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i am half irish half armenian, ireland is free from england, but armenia has yet to be free from the clutches of turkey



QUOTE(prot9999 @ 04/23/07 07:22 PM) [snapback]107666[/snapback]
Yours stupids still think same stupid dream? icon_lol.gif Rumtaya are you really serious? Can you fight against to us from Germany? Diri can fight from Norway? And other nothing guys can yours fight against Turkish Armenies?? I never think, yours just see dream, but impossible dream. icon_lol.gif

Kurds, Assyrians and Armenians yours are nothing. Yours will never stole any land from us. I'm sure yours now make masturbation with looking these stupid pictures. Your Abhazas!!! How much Assyrian soldier have? How much armenian can fight againt Turkish army? How much kurd can fight against Turkish Commandos? Be real do first!

Yours no any luck against Turkish Commandos. Anyone want try? Why yours living 5000 km later from Anatolia?

Kerkuk, Musul, Yerevan are Turkish cities and nearly time we will get back all. Look reals and keep your stupid dreams.

LOL Regards!


yours still are not learn to speake proper english? once yours arse learned to speak a real language and not somes blabbering and sheep sounds (I.E. turkish) Then yours are make able to write on this forume...understand?!

what dyou mean no one can stand up to turkish wonderful courageous army?
you tried to take cyprus and the greeks milita held off your crappy special forces. youv been trying to whipe out the PKK for thirty years and here they are strong as ever. ASALA, a cell with almost 2000 members, was able to do more damage then your army to it. only a few were caught. they never disbanded because of "turkish intelligence" they disbanded because of armenian pressure. all those mounting failures have proven that you are a weak state. youv created so many enemies in the past century that I dont even give you another century. soon, the kurds will start getting more agressive. the world will have turned its back on you. the armenians will bash through your "border patrol" and the greeks will want a part of the action themselves.

now for kurdistan. (sorry diri I hadnt answered yet)
I personnally like the kurds. sure they did bad stuff, but they have proven to me that they are real men. they have apologised for their wrongs and have supported armenians for a while now. they helped us in artsakh by supplying PKK stockpiled wepaons, they held joint attacks with ASALA.
Obviously the land inhabited today by kurds used to belong to armenians, but lets be realistic. the borders arnt gonna change anytime soon and if we do get the lands...whos gonna live there?

point being. if kurds live there, fine, as long as they dont destroy our sacred monuments and invent pathetic cover stories to explain how they got there...then I'm fine with it.


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Hosank
post 04/23/07 03:32 PM
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first..i do not hate kurds, and i do not accuse them for what happened in the genocide..though it is true that many kurds were manipulated by the turks into commiting genocide.

QUOTE
Armenians have traditionally lived in the Armenian highland, while the Kurds lived in Northern Mesopotamia, next to the Assyrians.


exactly....MESOPOTAMIA..anatolia is not mesopotamia. cities like van, erzerum and so on had very few kurds in them before 1919 when the turks force settled kurdish tribesmen into armenian cities now vacant.

QUOTE
Even 200 years ago, Kurds weren't an organized and united nation. For instance, a Kurd identified himself with his tribe (tribes even had names of their own) rather than with the whole Kurdish nation.


yes, and now you just want the whole middle east to change to give you a coutry from the black sea, the mediteranian to the persian gulf??

we armenians were organised 200 years ago, we armenians were organised 5000 years ago. we deserve our land.

QUOTE
urds, Assyrians and Armenians yours are nothing. Yours will never stole any land from us. I'm sure yours now make masturbation with looking these stupid pictures. Your Abhazas!!! How much Assyrian soldier have? How much armenian can fight againt Turkish army?


it is your conviction in the fact that you have properly stolen our lands that will lead to your ultimate defeat, and your flight to kazakstan.

i also support an Assyrian state with borders to a greater armenia.




those are the official borders of armenia. both kurdistan and assyria should be to the south of that.


but seriously though..there is enough land to share for everyone, at the expense of the turks of course icon_biggrin.gif

why don't the kurds let the Assyrians have their triangle..connected to armenia,..that way assyria can have a way out.

and kurdistan could be around it?
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DÓrÓ
post 04/23/07 05:15 PM
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QUOTE(Hosank @ 04/23/07 04:32 PM) [snapback]107694[/snapback]
first..i do not hate kurds, and i do not accuse them for what happened in the genocide..though it is true that many kurds were manipulated by the turks into commiting genocide.
exactly....MESOPOTAMIA..anatolia is not mesopotamia. cities like van, erzerum and so on had very few kurds in them before 1919 when the turks force settled kurdish tribesmen into armenian cities now vacant.
yes, and now you just want the whole middle east to change to give you a coutry from the black sea, the mediteranian to the persian gulf??

we armenians were organised 200 years ago, we armenians were organised 5000 years ago. we deserve our land.
it is your conviction in the fact that you have properly stolen our lands that will lead to your ultimate defeat, and your flight to kazakstan.

i also support an Assyrian state with borders to a greater armenia.


those are the official borders of armenia. both kurdistan and assyria should be to the south of that.
but seriously though..there is enough land to share for everyone, at the expense of the turks of course icon_biggrin.gif

why don't the kurds let the Assyrians have their triangle..connected to armenia,..that way assyria can have a way out.

and kurdistan could be around it?


Who are you talking to?

You ARE aware that I didn't say those things which you have quoted??? Those are the words of others...

All the while, you reply like you were actually talking to ME...

But either way... I suggest you re-evaluate your stance... Because God knows it won't be like your fantasising about...

"Kurdistan could be around it"???? What the hell is that gonna look like? icon_lol.gif
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DÓrÓ
post 04/23/07 05:24 PM
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QUOTE(irlandahay @ 04/23/07 04:10 PM) [snapback]107689[/snapback]
now for kurdistan. (sorry diri I hadnt answered yet)
I personnally like the kurds. sure they did bad stuff, but they have proven to me that they are real men. they have apologised for their wrongs and have supported armenians for a while now. they helped us in artsakh by supplying PKK stockpiled wepaons, they held joint attacks with ASALA.
Obviously the land inhabited today by kurds used to belong to armenians, but lets be realistic. the borders arnt gonna change anytime soon and if we do get the lands...whos gonna live there?

point being. if kurds live there, fine, as long as they dont destroy our sacred monuments and invent pathetic cover stories to explain how they got there...then I'm fine with it.


Thank you for your kind words... Indeed I support Armenian rights - and as far as possible, also claims and demands...

I see the importance of your historical lands and I see how these lands are part of your heritage...

As you said, WHEN the borders are re-drawn, it is going to be hard for a 3 million state Armenia to inhabit a massive land - which already has a far majority Kurdish population... It would mean, realistically, to throw out every Kurdish family from these lands... That in itself would be a genocide... Which the Armenians were so unlucky to face themselves only 84 years ago...

I, like 99% of all Kurds recognize and apologise for the cruel acts that my nation has inflicted on you and your families...

Kurdistan and Armenia have historically had good relations - and we share so much in cultural terms - it's not always easy to separate the two...

When Turkey's oppressive regime falls - and democracy is given a chance, I hope historically important areas for Armenians in todays Turkey, like Ani, Qars and Ararat - which are close to the Armenian border, are given back to the Armenians...

It's a wish from my heart... Because although I wish you could get all of it back, I know it's not realistic, but a compromise may be possible...

BijÓ Hayastan Ż Kurdistan!
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Hosank
post 04/23/07 05:41 PM
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yah, sorry about that..i answered pretty much everyone in the same post...
what i mean by around, is that assyria could be bordered by the state of kurdistan which you wish to create
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DÓrÓ
post 04/23/07 05:50 PM
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QUOTE(Hosank @ 04/23/07 06:41 PM) [snapback]107721[/snapback]
yah, sorry about that..i answered pretty much everyone in the same post...
what i mean by around, is that assyria could be bordered by the state of kurdistan which you wish to create


Could you perhaps put your words on a map?

I want to see what your idea looks like in reality...
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Hosank
post 04/23/07 06:08 PM
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umm...i tried to post a map, but it didn't work...im not sure why...

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irlandahay
post 04/23/07 06:23 PM
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Conflict/Cultural/Country Interest: ARMENIA!

i am half irish half armenian, ireland is free from england, but armenia has yet to be free from the clutches of turkey



QUOTE(DÓrÓ @ 04/23/07 11:24 PM) [snapback]107717[/snapback]
When Turkey's oppressive regime falls - and democracy is given a chance, I hope historically important areas for Armenians in todays Turkey, like Ani, Qars and Ararat - which are close to the Armenian border, are given back to the Armenians...

It's a wish from my heart... Because although I wish you could get all of it back, I know it's not realistic, but a compromise may be possible...

BijÓ Hayastan Ż Kurdistan!


you took the words right out of my mouth! icon_biggrin.gif

biji hayastan u kurdistan!
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Hosank
post 04/23/07 06:42 PM
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right, so i created a map, but it's hand made, so since i am not that aware of all kurdish claims, i have tried to imitate certain maps i found..i don't know what is accurate, so please do not be angry..
what i payed special attention to is the souther border of greater armenia, a state of assyria, following, approximately the Assyrian triangle..Assyrians, please do not be mad if it isn't at the right place, assuring it a border with armenia, and the rest is kurdistan, as you can see, kurdistan still gets a larger area.

i also tried to make the map fair for all nations, so i placed north western azerbaijan in georgia, southern georgia in dual ownership with armenia, and northern iran as part of azerbaijan
we too agree that gaining all the territories on which armenians lived is unrealistic, that is why all we demand is wilsonian armenia, promised to us in the treaty of sevres



but, i have no idea how to upload the map from my computer, so if anyone knows...
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Ishkhan
post 04/23/07 08:39 PM
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Try uploading it here: http://imageshack.us/

And posting the link here (click on Insert Image) for us to see...
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Hosank
post 04/23/07 08:42 PM
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thanks ishxan




kurdistan is in yellow, i know it doesn't show that much but
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Ishkhan
post 04/23/07 08:43 PM
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Diri, in that map of yours, the part in rose is "Armenians, Ossetes, Tates, Kurds, and Persians" all together, so it's not precise enough.
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DÓrÓ
post 04/24/07 04:03 AM
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QUOTE(Hosank @ 04/23/07 09:42 PM) [snapback]107762[/snapback]
thanks ishxan


kurdistan is in yellow, i know it doesn't show that much but



In the Wilsonian Armenia, Kurds are the majority of the population...

What will you do with them? Genocide them?
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DÓrÓ
post 04/24/07 04:05 AM
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QUOTE(Ishkhan @ 04/23/07 09:43 PM) [snapback]107763[/snapback]
Diri, in that map of yours, the part in rose is "Armenians, Ossetes, Tates, Kurds, and Persians" all together, so it's not precise enough.


Yes - true, they are all in the rose part...

But if you look at the map - not at the legends - you will see it writes "Kurds" in the Pontus mountain range...
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Rumtaya
post 04/24/07 04:17 AM
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QUOTE(Hosank @ 04/24/07 04:42 AM) [snapback]107762[/snapback]
thanks ishxan


kurdistan is in yellow, i know it doesn't show that much but


Hey, bro your map isnt that good, because 60-70% of northern Iraq is Assyrian Homelands, left out are just the Mountain areas of Zagros(suleimani province,parts of arbil province and parts of dohuk province)



This would be much better
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Hosank
post 04/24/07 05:53 AM
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actually, i tried to copy that map, but again, it was hand drawn so the borders arn't great.

but, there are only about 2 million Assyrians in the world...how will they fill the entire northern iraK? at the expense of the kurds and turkomen..

anyways..i tired to make the map fair for Assyrians, but as i said, it's hand drawn
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Ishkhan
post 04/24/07 05:59 AM
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Kurds in those borders would be allowed to live as Armenian citizens, and would enjoy it just like their Yezidi Kurdish brothers in Armenia today.
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HayArsen
post 04/24/07 06:00 AM
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QUOTE(Ishkhan @ 04/24/07 05:59 AM) [snapback]107792[/snapback]
Kurds in those borders would be allowed to live as Armenian citizens, and would enjoy it just like their Yezidi Kurdish brothers in Armenia today.


As long as the Armenians are majority I am ok with that
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Rumtaya
post 04/24/07 09:54 AM
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QUOTE(Hosank @ 04/24/07 01:53 PM) [snapback]107787[/snapback]
actually, i tried to copy that map, but again, it was hand drawn so the borders arn't great.

but, there are only about 2 million Assyrians in the world...how will they fill the entire northern iraK? at the expense of the kurds and turkomen..

anyways..i tired to make the map fair for Assyrians, but as i said, it's hand drawn



This isnt the whole Northern Iraq as you see, those are the main Assyrian parts...of khabour area(northeast syria), tur abdin(the area of mardin and so), and finally Nohadra(dohuk) and Nineveh area...
There are countries...like Sweden, Norway who are much bigger than the are I marked and have a popluation between 5-8 mio...

my guess for the population in this area is between 3-4 mio, of who are at least 700 000 - 1 000 000 Assyrians...., the thing is, that Assyrians have a owner ship in those parts, which makes villages, and agrulity land..., the problem is...those part are within 3 States...Turkey, where Tur Abdin lies...,Syria, where the khabour area lies (the village I come from is in it too) and finally Irak (Northern Iraq), where nohadra and ninawa lies....

Still this is a map, which is also hand drawn, we are not looking for any wars, to tack form as soon as posible an Assyrian State.


We are looking, for repopulation nohadra and nineveh area, which is on the way..., many villages have been rebuild and illegal occuption is on some few villages ended...

as example...the village of semele (shmet el), which means in Assyrian name of god, some of its original people have been brought back to it, which where forced 20 years ago by saddam to ressetle in other parts of iraq....

there are other exmaples of that, but still we have some occupdied villages, by kurdish neighbours, where we are looking for to get them on a peacefull way back...I am sure the Kurds will understand that, since they claim also arab occuptied cites...like kirkuk.

Peace for the Middle East
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davit2
post 04/24/07 02:25 PM
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i have a realllyy biig question (again im in real life davit who been in this forum for a long time i just forgot my password so i started a new account )

my question - whats biji why is everyone saying biji what that means im 100% sure thats not armenian so what is it?
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irlandahay
post 04/24/07 02:42 PM
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Conflict/Cultural/Country Interest: ARMENIA!

i am half irish half armenian, ireland is free from england, but armenia has yet to be free from the clutches of turkey



QUOTE(Ishkhan @ 04/24/07 11:59 AM) [snapback]107792[/snapback]
Kurds in those borders would be allowed to live as Armenian citizens, and would enjoy it just like their Yezidi Kurdish brothers in Armenia today.


right...and then our population would be 13 000 000 moslem kurds and a whole 3 000 000 armenians. then the PKK will become agressive and pull a bunch of crap against the armenians. our wonderful 60 000 strong army will have to interfere, there will be a wonderful spill of bloodshed...

lets be realistic here
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DÓrÓ
post 04/24/07 02:44 PM
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QUOTE(davit2 @ 04/24/07 03:25 PM) [snapback]107808[/snapback]
i have a realllyy biig question (again im in real life davit who been in this forum for a long time i just forgot my password so i started a new account )

my question - whats biji why is everyone saying biji what that means im 100% sure thats not armenian so what is it?



icon_lol.gif We know you're Davit... Don't need to say it everytime you're going to post... icon_lol.gif


BijÓ is Kurdish, and is imperative of "To live"...

Imperative = Order...

So "BijÓ Hayastan" means "LIVE(!) Hayastan":)



By the way... BIJő HAYASTAN! icon_cool.gif
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davit2
post 04/24/07 02:47 PM
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QUOTE(irlandahay @ 04/24/07 02:42 PM) [snapback]107813[/snapback]
right...and then our population would be 13 000 000 moslem kurds and a whole 3 000 000 armenians. then the PKK will become agressive and pull a bunch of crap against the armenians. our wonderful 60 000 strong army will have to interfere, there will be a wonderful spill of bloodshed...

lets be realistic here


i dont know if you mean by that that ok kurds wont be a problem for us or th opposite please explain.


TURAN DYING....
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DÓrÓ
post 04/24/07 02:48 PM
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QUOTE(irlandahay @ 04/24/07 03:42 PM) [snapback]107813[/snapback]
right...and then our population would be 13 000 000 moslem kurds and a whole 3 000 000 armenians. then the PKK will become agressive and pull a bunch of crap against the armenians. our wonderful 60 000 strong army will have to interfere, there will be a wonderful spill of bloodshed...

lets be realistic here



Heeeeeeeeeey... icon_neutral.gif


Bro - I was gonna say that... icon_lol.gif


But on a more serious note - you are right, the population of Wilsonian Armenia (as put down in The Treaty Of SŤvres, as of today, is by far Kurdish... In fact, there may well be just as many Turks in Wilsonian Armenia as there are Armenians if Greater Armenia was a reality today... smiley17.gif

What is 100% sure: there are millions upon millions of Kurds in that area today...
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DÓrÓ
post 04/24/07 02:49 PM
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QUOTE(davit2 @ 04/24/07 03:47 PM) [snapback]107816[/snapback]
i dont know if you mean by that that ok kurds wont be a problem for us or th opposite please explain.
TURAN DYING....


icon_lol.gif
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davit2
post 04/24/07 02:51 PM
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QUOTE(DÓrÓ @ 04/24/07 02:44 PM) [snapback]107814[/snapback]
icon_lol.gif We know you're Davit... Don't need to say it everytime you're going to post... icon_lol.gif
BijÓ is Kurdish, and is imperative of "To live"...

Imperative = Order...

So "BijÓ Hayastan" means "LIVE(!) Hayastan":)
By the way... BIJő HAYASTAN! icon_cool.gif


oooooooooooooooo now i git it BUT does bijit means the same thing
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irlandahay
post 04/24/07 02:56 PM
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Conflict/Cultural/Country Interest: ARMENIA!

i am half irish half armenian, ireland is free from england, but armenia has yet to be free from the clutches of turkey



QUOTE(davit2 @ 04/24/07 08:47 PM) [snapback]107816[/snapback]
i dont know if you mean by that that ok kurds wont be a problem for us or th opposite please explain.
TURAN DYING....


im saying I dont mind kurds living in our lands as long as they respect it and treat it with the care it deserves. there are beautiful 4000 year old monuments there. but I'm saying if we integrate them into armenia, it would cause sectarian violence. its not good. it will only leave room for hatred and more problems.

think of it like this. there are 13 000 000 kurds living in armenia (if it happens obviously). why would they want to be called armenians? there are only 3000 000 armenians living in armenia. it should be kurdistan since there are more kurds then armenians right? it jsut doesnt make sense anymore...why should we be called armenia if there are no armenians left? call me racist for wanting to defend my culture!
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DÓrÓ
post 04/24/07 02:57 PM
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QUOTE(davit2 @ 04/24/07 03:51 PM) [snapback]107820[/snapback]
oooooooooooooooo now i git it BUT does bijit means the same thing


"BijÓt" means the same thing, except it's in 3rd person...

In e.g. you are not speaking directly to "Hayastan" if you say "BijÓt Hayastan"... You are speaking to somebody else and saying "BijÓ Hayastan" then you can put the "t" at the end, which makes puts the verb in third person! icon_smile.gif

Get it?

Let me illustrate with an imaginary conversation between you and me:

Sohrab: BijÓt Hayastan!!!
Davit: Yeaaah!!! And BijÓt Kurdistan!!!

OR one of us could refere directly to Hayastan or Kurdistan and say "BijÓ Hayastan/Kurdistan"...

But BijÓ is of course also used about humans and other things...

It's used frequently in conversations in Kurdish:

Sohrab: «awanÓ? başÓ bira? --- "How are you? Are you okey brother?"
DavÓt: Ez başim, sipas! BijÓ... --- "I am fine, thanks! Live..."

Here "BijÓ" means "Thank you for asking - may you live long"... icon_wink.gif
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davit2
post 04/24/07 03:13 PM
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QUOTE(DÓrÓ @ 04/24/07 02:57 PM) [snapback]107822[/snapback]
"BijÓt" means the same thing, except it's in 3rd person...

In e.g. you are not speaking directly to "Hayastan" if you say "BijÓt Hayastan"... You are speaking to somebody else and saying "BijÓ Hayastan" then you can put the "t" at the end, which makes puts the verb in third person! icon_smile.gif

Get it?

Let me illustrate with an imaginary conversation between you and me:

Sohrab: BijÓt Hayastan!!!
Davit: Yeaaah!!! And BijÓt Kurdistan!!!

OR one of us could refere directly to Hayastan or Kurdistan and say "BijÓ Hayastan/Kurdistan"...

But BijÓ is of course also used about humans and other things...

It's used frequently in conversations in Kurdish:

Sohrab: «awanÓ? başÓ bira? --- "How are you? Are you okey brother?"
DavÓt: Ez başim, sipas! BijÓ... --- "I am fine, thanks! Live..."

Here "BijÓ" means "Thank you for asking - may you live long"... icon_wink.gif


and now i get it all

bijit me biji you and qunem turk.
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DÓrÓ
post 04/24/07 04:28 PM
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QUOTE(davit2 @ 04/24/07 04:13 PM) [snapback]107824[/snapback]
and now i get it all

bijit me biji you and qunem turk.


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