West Armenia Or North Kurdistan?, Discussing the matter of land ownership... Options

[arrow]

honestly arrow, that would be awesome if someone with a cooler head could rule the middle east, but its been done before, and it failed( ie:british)

Maybe the timing was wrong. I had Japanesee in my mind. I've been there twice and the respect they have for other people and the moral laws made me wonder how it would be with them in this part of world.

[Darkseid]

"WE" is the people on this part of Earth stuck with each other and actually has no other place to go. Like it or not Armenia is between Azerbaycan and Turkiye, and some of my countrymen may like it or not but there are over 7 million Kurdish citizens are living in Turkiye and etc.....

Kurds are descendents of Hurrians. Hurrians have always lived in those areas of Anatolia. Turkey is pretty much a newcomer to the Middle-East. Semetic People, Indo-Europeans, and Caucasians have lived in this area of the world for centuries before the Altaic people (Turks).

[arrow]

And we all come from Adam and Eve. Also the difference of an Ape DNA and Human DNA is less than 0,02 percent

[Darkseid]

And we all come from Adam and Eve. Also the difference of an Ape DNA and Human DNA is less than 0,02 percent

No... we are humans, but we are different breeds/clans of humans.

If you knew about as much about this world as I do, you would be dead from so much shock and realization.

[Glock21]

No... we are humans, but we are different breeds/clans of humans.

If you knew about as much about this world as I do, you would dead from so much shock and realization.

Pull you finger out of your butt and get real. You fail to impress on so many levels.

[Darkseid]

Pull you finger out of your butt and get real. You fail to impress on so many levels.

Impress who?

[Glock21]

Impress who?

I take it English is your second language, and really, there's nothing wrong with that.

[Darkseid]

I take it English is your second language, and really, there's nothing wrong with that.

LOL! You are such a troll. And your English sucks on so many levels. Honestly!

You fail to impress "insert word" on so many levels

A) Me
B) Us
C) Everyone
D) Yourself
E) The aliens

Take your pick, because you made an incomplete sentence.

[Glock21]

LOL! You are such a troll. And your English sucks on so many levels. Honestly!

Surely you jest... having been educated in the UK, the Queen's English is my most common mode of communication, unlike yours, which is marked by a close to intelligible barrage of horrendous spelling, syntax, and grammar.

[Glock21]

LOL! You are such a troll. And your English sucks on so many levels. Honestly!
A) Me
B) Us
C) Everyone
D) Yourself
E) The aliens

Take your pick, because you made an incomplete sentence.

You fail.

If you knew English well enough you would realize not every verb requires a direct object, "impress" being one of those. Welcome to the 2nd grade.

[Darkseid]

Surely you jest... having been educated in the UK, the Queen's English is my most common mode of communication, unlike yours, which is marked by a close to intelligible barrage of horrendous spelling, syntax, and grammar.

Trolling again I see...

I bet you get a big kick out of all of this? Is that all you do?

Last time I checked no one cares about grammar, syntax, and spelling. LOL! And you double posted too. How strange...

[Glock21]

Wherefore art thou my double post?

You indeed should care about precise communication; it just, how shall I put it, makes you not seem so ignorant. Go forth and improve.

[Glock21]

BTW DarkSide, I am just jesting with you, due to extreme bouts of indifference at work. We should perhaps direct back to topic, lest the Kurds and Armenians grow more intensely angry at this aside.

[Darkseid]

LOL! You double posted again.

[Glock21]

LOL! You double posted again.

What? Unless my eyes are prematurely losing function, I haven't once.

[arrow]

Darkseid, I fail to catch your points, I think you need to take a breath and relax a bit. You are taking it personal and it is not helping the debate..

[Darkseid]

Darkseid, I fail to catch your points, I think you need to take a breath and relax a bit. You are taking it personal and it is not helping the debate..

Personal? I thought it was quite obvious that I was just fooling around.

I think the reason why you decided to fake this needed response is due to your pre-meditary need to cause harm to me for saying something negative about you and your people. I don't blame you. But you obviously need a better means of enacting your vengeful agenda.

Seriously, most Turks are genetically Armenians and Greeks. Armenians already know this, right Yerevan? Arrow could just be a fellow Armenian that threw away his ethnic identity to be a part of something that is fake.

[irlandahay]

and some of my countrymen may like it or not but there are over 7 million Kurdish citizens are living in Turkiye and etc.....

so your a turk...

[irlandahay]

Maybe the timing was wrong. I had Japanesee in my mind. I've been there twice and the respect they have for other people and the moral laws made me wonder how it would be with them in this part of world.

yes sure, I'm sure the Native americans would want a peace lets invite them to rule us, hey lets ask the peruvians to come along too! It'l be one big multicultural fiesta here in the mideast yep... wel ahve loads of fun fun fun, respect and justice! wow what a wonderful world we live in!

and once the crack wares off, we must realise that no one is fit to rule but ourselves. there are those who rule and those who serve. Armenians rule Armenia...end of story!

I would die witha gun in my hand before I see a aturk or azeri rule my homeland!

[arrow]

Yes I am a Turk.

And the rulership of Mid East was nothing to be taken serious. I know it is impossible..

Honestly I couldn't care less who rules armenia and why... There is nothing of interest there, at least for me.

@ Darkseid; it was just a friendly advise, to have a meaningfull debate we should keep within some limits. And calling names is childish.

[Hosank]

ok, so let's try to remember what the topic was...


western armena or northern kurdistan..

though we already made all the valuable points necessary to the argument...meaning that wislonian armenia sould and will become armenian.
the end..
southern turkey couuld become kurdish..

[arrow]

I have one question. By referring to ancestoral homelands of armenians and kurds, what are the dates of the states your ancestors ruled these lands?

If i am not mistaken we came here in the begining of 1070's and we fought against Byzantine empire, not an armenian nor kurd empire.

Any info will be apreciated and thnx.

[irlandahay]

Yes I am a Turk.

I'm curious...what is your stance on Armenian genocide?
what do YOU think happened?

[HayArsen]

I'm curious...what is your stance on Armenian genocide?
what do YOU think happened?

Do you really need an answer?

[arrow]

Do you really need an answer?

Really, do you ?

Btw I am still waiting for the question I posted. When did armenians ans kurd had states in Anatolia?

C'mon guys, I need help on this.

[intergalacticman]

I have one question. By referring to ancestoral homelands of armenians and kurds, what are the dates of the states your ancestors ruled these lands?

If i am not mistaken we came here in the begining of 1070's and we fought against Byzantine empire, not an armenian nor kurd empire.

Any info will be apreciated and thnx.

Awesome, i just read the "The History of the Armenian People Vol. 1" last week from the library. It chronicles the Armenian people from ancient times to the 13th century, and mentions just that.

while there was little kurdish reference, the armenian 'empire' had its own king of the ruling dynasty, (the bagratunis) The Armenians were on the byzantine frontier, and maintained autonomy except for a tribute of like 25,000 horsemen to the byzantine army ( armenian cavalry was very effective then) and a head tax per family paid to the Byzantine emperor.

During armenia's history, control of armenia shifted around every couple hundred years between the persians and the romans. during that time it was under byzantine rule. the armenians and georgians fought against mongol forces in the northern caucuses, and turkish and turkmen in the east and south, and later arab forces in the east and south. Since that region was extremely dynamic in terms of geopolitical boundaries, it is difficult to explain in greater detail without huge posts.

[irlandahay]

Really, do you ?

Btw I am still waiting for the question I posted. When did armenians ans kurd had states in Anatolia?

C'mon guys, I need help on this.

I need an answer.

and we havnt been rulers in our own land for a long time but that doesnt mean that we have no right to govern ourselves. since the turks came theyv left a trail of rampage and destruction. They are worse then the mongols because at least mongols LEAVE!

turks have no right to proclaim themselves kings when they are only good at stealing lands from unarmed women and children!

[arrow]

and we havnt been rulers in our own land for a long time but that doesnt mean that we have no right to govern ourselves.

Do you not govern yourselves at the moment?

So Turks did not take these lands from an armeni state but Bzyantine empire, right?

[irlandahay]

Do you not govern yourselves at the moment?

So Turks did not take these lands from an armeni state but Bzyantine empire, right?

where speaking english here. its Armenian state not armeni. dont speak your snake tongue hear...

turks stole these lands from its original inhabitants. its the people wh make the land. they killed and displaced all those who used to be there. we have the rights to our lands no matter how long ago we havnt seen them...

[arrow]

where speaking english here.

Lol I can see that you speaking English where Btw I cannot speak through a monitor so I prefer to type in English

turks stole these lands from its original inhabitants. its the people wh make the land. they killed and displaced all those who used to be there. we have the rights to our lands no matter how long ago we havnt seen them...

No you are totally wrong, we took these lands from Bzyntine empire, we allowed you to live on the lands we conquered from the Bzyntine. Don't make things up

[irlandahay]

Lol I can see that you speaking English where Btw I cannot speak through a monitor so I prefer to type in English
No you are totally wrong, we took these lands from Bzyntine empire, we allowed you to live on the lands we conquered from the Bzyntine. Don't make things up

I wasnt talking about spelling or grammar mistakes. I was talking about you using your disgusting slithering language on this forum. and I dont speak in a monitor, I'm fluent you moron..

oh really..you ALLOWED us to live there? you saved us from total obliteration, oh thank you wonderful turkish saviours, for helping us escape the evil unjust clutches of Byzantium.
you need to leanr a thing or two about history before talking...

[arrow]

I wasnt talking about spelling or grammar mistakes. I was talking about you using your disgusting slithering language on this forum. and I dont speak in a monitor, I'm fluent you moron..

oh really..you ALLOWED us to live there? you saved us from total obliteration, oh thank you wonderful turkish saviours, for helping us escape the evil unjust clutches of Byzantium.
you need to leanr a thing or two about history before talking...

Tell me have you ever been in a school for educational reasons I mean your English sucks, no offense just a statement.

Anyways, for the allowing part; more than once you whined about how we took away your lands after 1919 and forced you to leave. Since we ruled Anatolia from 1071 till today and if you were forced to leave in 1919 then it means someone let you live here and then decided that you are not wellcome any more.

Now who that someone would be

Ps: I hope I am not typing too complicated for you to understand. Please ask me if you don't understand anypart of the context

[irlandahay]

Tell me have you ever been in a school for educational reasons I mean your English sucks, no offense just a statement.

Anyways, for the allowing part; more than once you whined about how we took away your lands after 1919 and forced you to leave. Since we ruled Anatolia from 1071 till today and if you were forced to leave in 1919 then it means someone let you live here and then decided that you are not wellcome any more.

Now who that someone would be

Ps: I hope I am not typing too complicated for you to understand. Please ask me if you don't understand anypart of the context

evere been in a school for educationnal reasons? isnt that what a school is to beginwith numnuts?
and no, my english is pretty damned good, just that when I type I get all excited and put some letters before others or type to fast. if your going to make fun of me for it you really have nothing better to do and only show just how pathetic and low turks can go.

rulers since 1071? really? because last I recall the turks were jsut an obstacle to the crusaders. last i recall the turks still resembled their mongol grandparents back then where they would ride, attack and then ride away again. You were masters of nothing.

Now when I said allow. I meant who are you to allow us to do anything? these are our lands, our homes and just because you butcher without compassion doesnt make you better then us. Armenians have contributed in that disgusting empire since they were forced into it. thats the thanks we get! we help fight off the sultan and instore democracy...or so we thought.

turks are the most treacherous vile and disgusting peaces of human waste this planet can ever produce.
It's only sad that some of us still trust you guys after all that crap you pulled!

PS: I'm surprised they have computers nin your yurt!

[arrow]

evere been in a school for educationnal reasons? isnt that what a school is to beginwith numnuts?

I really think you are a pusher or just a little kid in 5th or 6th grade

rulers since 1071? really? because last I recall the turks were jsut an obstacle to the crusaders. last i recall the turks still resembled their mongol grandparents back then where they would ride, attack and then ride away again. You were masters of nothing.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Seljuk_Empire

"The Seljuqs were a Sunni Muslim dynasty that ruled parts of Central Asia and the Middle East from the 11th to 14th centuries. They set up an empire known as "Great Seljuk Empire" that stretched from Anatolia to Punjab and was the target of the First Crusade."

11th century is between 1000 and 1100. Selcuks entered anatolia in 1071 and since than we have been The rulers of these lands. Honestly we never had a conflict with an armeni state.

Oh, and when we came to Anadolu we loved it so much we decided that it was time to settle

Now when I said allow. I meant who are you to allow us to do anything?

It is becouse we don't allow you anymore to live here you are stuck up in that pathetic excuse of a land.

turks are the most treacherous vile and disgusting peaces of human waste this planet can ever produce.
It's only sad that some of us still trust you guys after all that crap you pulled!

Planets do not produce humans, is that what they teach you at school ( if you are going to a school that is).

PS: I'm surprised they have computers nin your yurt!

We have internet users more than the populatin of armenia

[irlandahay]

I really think you are a pusher or just a little kid in 5th or 6th grade
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Seljuk_Empire

"The Seljuqs were a Sunni Muslim dynasty that ruled parts of Central Asia and the Middle East from the 11th to 14th centuries. They set up an empire known as "Great Seljuk Empire" that stretched from Anatolia to Punjab and was the target of the First Crusade."

11th century is between 1000 and 1100. Selcuks entered anatolia in 1071 and since than we have been The rulers of these lands. Honestly we never had a conflict with an armeni state.

Oh, and when we came to Anadolu we loved it so much we decided that it was time to settle
It is becouse we don't allow you anymore to live here you are stuck up in that pathetic excuse of a land.
Planets do not produce humans, is that what they teach you at school ( if you are going to a school that is).
We have internet users more than the populatin of armenia

thats the best you can come up with? I shut you up and you tell me I'm a poor little kid? haha, your a turk! your word means nothing to anyone! now go make threats to the americans! "if you fly over my land again I'm going to..." what?! your going to what?! haha thought so!

An armeni state? Anadolu?
once you start speaking english then I'l deal with you. I'm sorry, I dont speak donkey and I'm in no mood to learn it!

It was a figure of speeche you dumb turkish turd. We are all on this rock and therefore it is our mother. Honestly, dont try to make fun of me when your not familiar with any expressions.

haha and then he makes fun of me for my english!

[arrow]

thats the best you can come up with? I shut you up and you tell me I'm a poor little kid?

Not only a kid but also a pusher

It was a figure of speeche you dumb turkish turd. We are all on this rock and therefore it is our mother.

If it is your mother I really wonder who your father is

PS: Do you have ANYTHING to say in regard to my previous post. It was pretty informational, at least if you have the capacity to understand..

[Darkseid]

Lol I can see that you speaking English where Btw I cannot speak through a monitor so I prefer to type in English
No you are totally wrong, we took these lands from Bzyntine empire, we allowed you to live on the lands we conquered from the Bzyntine. Don't make things up

You didn't took land away from the Byzantines (Greeks). You were one of those unfortunate people who's family history involves turkification. You are actually descendent of those that were conquered by the Ottomans.

Not only a kid but also a pusher
If it is your mother I really wonder who your father is

PS: Do you have ANYTHING to say in regard to my previous post. It was pretty informational, at least if you have the capacity to understand..

I have something to say. Evolution proves that mankind was spawned on this planet from goo and evolved into humans. Therefore, planets to produce people. We were produced from the Earth.

[arrow]

You didn't took land away from the Byzantines (Greeks). You were one of those unfortunate people who's family history involves turkification. You are actually descendent of those that were conquered by the Ottomans.
I have something to say. Evolution proves that mankind was spawned on this planet from goo and evolved into humans. Therefore, planets to produce people. We were produced from the Earth.

Darkseid just for once I will share my opinion about the genome and race thing with you and I hope it will give you a better idea about me.

I agree with you when you said that I am probably a descendant of Bzyntines, actually I think I am part Greek part Turk. My eyes are almond shaped like those of Asian Turks / Mongols but rest of me looks Italian / Greek. But all my ideas are Turkish.

So when you say that I am a result of a Turkification process I agree you, and I am happy with who I am. I am proud of my Bzyntine heritage as well of my Turkic / Mongol heritage. Becouse I believe no race is better than anyother in this god created planet. And what is more better then being part of 2 great nations who ruled the known planet for centuries

I also agree you that evolution has great importance about describing life on Earth but I don't agree you on the creation part. I think God created life here and then we evolved. And even if you were right about evolution you'd still be wrong about the planet part becouse there are planets with no life on them.

[intergalacticman]

so, uh, i guess no one disagrees with me then?

[Evîn]

MEIC EDIT [GUYS, CAN WE LOSE THE PERSONAL REMARKS PLEASE, SHOOT THE MESSAGE AND NOT THE MESSENGER. CAN YOU ALSO REFRAIN FROM QUOTING OTHER MEMBERS IN YOUR SIGNATURES TOO. FINALLY, ALTHOUGH THIS IS AN ENGLISH LANGUAGE FORUM, ENGLISH IS NOT THE FIRST LANGUAGE FOR MANY OF OUR MEMBERS, PLEASE BEAR THIS IN MIND] EVIN

[arrow]

MEIC EDIT [GUYS, CAN WE LOSE THE PERSONAL REMARKS PLEASE, SHOOT THE MESSAGE AND NOT THE MESSENGER. CAN YOU ALSO REFRAIN FROM QUOTING OTHER MEMBERS IN YOUR SIGNATURES TOO. FINALLY, ALTHOUGH THIS IS AN ENGLISH LANGUAGE FORUM, ENGLISH IS NOT THE FIRST LANGUAGE FOR MANY OF OUR MEMBERS, PLEASE BEAR THIS IN MIND] EVIN

Now if you can only send a message about racist remarks, all would be perfect, wouldn't it?

[Darkseid]

Gah

[Darkseid]

Now if you can only send a message about racist remarks, all would be perfect, wouldn't it?

What racism? Prejudicism you could say. But if I spoke badly about any turk at all, would I really imply racism? Or am I just being prejudicist towards your nationality? It isn't like I'm actually attacking something that could be identified as a race or something close enough. I wouldn't be attacking Negroids, Caucasianoids, or Mongoloids by speaking badly about Turks. Because you can have all three kinds of people living in that single state, identifying themselves as turks. So what is the problem?

However I think your tone against Celtic people could be identified as racism. Celts are a group of people that have been often identified as a race, unlike the highly complex diversity that exists amongst "your" people.

[arrow]

What racism? Prejudicism you could say. But if I spoke badly about any turk at all, would I really imply racism? Or am I just being prejudicist towards your nationality?

Well, you as a person may not be a racist in the manner of right winged extremes ( altough your obsession with genome history is wierd ) doesn't mean that there are no racists in these forums. Please save me the trouble and read the posts again.

PS: insulting a person constantly about his identity and talking about how good it would be to kill him for his identity ( not genomes, identity ) is racism.....

[arrow]

sorry double post.

[Hosank]

see, during the byzantine empire, there was such a thing as a country of armenia, with it's own kings, princes, armies, nobilities and so on...

the role of armenia and greeks in the byzantine empire was somewhat like austria and hungary in the austro-hongarian empire.
and, btw, the byzantine ceasers that you fought were of armenian descent, the armies that you battled against were of armenian descent and the lands that you fought on were armenians..
so yes, you did take OUR land away from us..

and, i can hardly say 'you let us live'

[Evîn]

Now if you can only send a message about racist remarks, all would be perfect, wouldn't it?

I thought I did, unless you feel racist remarks don't count as personal?

[Hosank]

lol

[irlandahay]

Not only a kid but also a pusher
If it is your mother I really wonder who your father is

PS: Do you have ANYTHING to say in regard to my previous post. It was pretty informational, at least if you have the capacity to understand..

do you even read my posts or do you randomly pick out a sentence and comment on it regardless of what it says?

I'm going to give you one more chance... read before you talk turk. I know its a habit in turkey, talking without knowing just what your talking about (your historical society is living proof of that!), but please try and refrain yourself.

[Darkseid]

see, during the byzantine empire, there was such a thing as a country of armenia, with it's own kings, princes, armies, nobilities and so on...

the role of armenia and greeks in the byzantine empire was somewhat like austria and hungary in the austro-hongarian empire.
and, btw, the byzantine ceasers that you fought were of armenian descent, the armies that you battled against were of armenian descent and the lands that you fought on were armenians..
so yes, you did take OUR land away from us..

and, i can hardly say 'you let us live'

Armenia was a state not a country of the Byzantine Empire.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Byzantine_Armenia

Vaspurakan was elevated to kingdom status in 908. It was annexed by the Byzantine Empire on 1021.

And again you became a state or province of the Empire.