 Why do the Chechens hate rule by Russia? |
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 08/26/05 04:31 PM
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THROUGH A history of sustained violence against Chechnya, Russia sowed the seeds of the Beslan tragedy.
For decades it watered those seeds with Chechen blood and Chechen tears. Now it is reaping a harvest of blind hatred and despair.
The brutalised Russian troops, their heads stuffed with insane racist filth, have ceased to see Chechens as human beings.
This, and their long tragedy under Russian rule, has meant some Chechens have stopped seeing Russians as human beings too. This is the explanation of Beslan.
The horror is on Putin’s conscience. The anti-war movement must inscribe his name alongside those of Bush and Blair as a war criminal.
North Ossetia, the tiny Caucasus republic where the siege took place last week, is a Russian military outpost.
After the USSR fell apart, the Kremlin poured weapons into the republic. By 1992 it had the highest quantity of arms per head of population of any country in the world. It was from North Ossetia that Russian tank columns rolled into Chechnya in December 1994.
This was the first of Russia’s most recent attempts to destroy Chechen independence.
That war saw Chechen cities razed to the ground under a carpet of fragmentation bombs.
The scale of destruction in the capital, Grozny, hadn’t been seen in an advanced industrial city since the battle of Stalingrad in 1943. For 18 months Russian troops raped, burned, looted and murdered.
An estimated 80,000 Chechens died, and a quarter of a million were made homeless.
The extreme brutality of the Russian army was summed up by the massacre at Samashki in April 1995. Like the My Lai massacre in Vietnam, Samashki became a symbol of Russia’s war on the Chechen people.
For two days elite Russian troops stormed through Samashki torching houses, burning people alive or shooting them. Over 100 were killed, all but four were civilians.
In May 1995, while the slaughter raged, Moscow celebrated 50 years since victory in World War Two. Yeltsin, the Russian president, compared the Chechens to the Nazis.
Chechens had heard this talk before—from the dictator Joseph Stalin. In 1944 Stalin deported the entire Chechen population—men and women, old and young.
Chechens were loaded into cattle wagons and deported to the freezing wastes of Kazakhstan. Some 130,000 perished during the journey.
Stalin accused the Chechens of collaborating with the Nazis. In reality he wanted to crush the resistance to Russian imperialism from nationalities within his empire. From 1938 to 1944 many other peoples were also deported to Siberia.
Stalin made sure no trace of the Chechen people or culture remained. Russian colonists took over Chechens’ homes and jobs. The headstones on Chechen graves were used to pave the streets.
Statues to the Tsarist general Yermolov were erected in towns and cities. Yermolov led Russia’s conquest of the Caucasus in the early 19th century.
But, as one Russian wrote at the time, “although the crater of the volcano had been cleansed, the internal fire was far from extinguished”.
In 1825 the volcano erupted in Chechnya. An uprising engulfed the country and spread across the Caucasus.
For the next 25 years the Chechens waged a furious struggle against Russian occupation, led by Imam Shamil.
Yermolov responded with the same methods used by Russian troops today—rape, siege, torture, burnings alive, putting entire villages to the sword.
In 1859 Shamil surrendered to the Russians. But 85 years later it was the memory of his resistance that Stalin wanted to destroy.
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From Stalin to Putin, the repression continues
True to their traditions, the Chechens fought back against Stalin’s repression with assassinations and mass rebellions. The deportation in 1944 was supposed to be the final act in smashing their resistance.
It failed. From the late 1950s Chechens illegally began to make their way back home.
The trickle became a flood. By the time the USSR collapsed in 1991 they were once again a majority in their homeland.
As the nations of the Soviet Union broke away from Russian rule, an uprising in Chechnya overthrew the puppet regime in Grozny and declared independence.
The Kremlin was desperate to restore its control of the Caucasus.
The oil pipeline to Russia from the Caspian oil fields ran straight through Grozny. Azerbaijan had opened negotiations with US, British, Turkish and Iranian companies to reroute supply to the south.
Russia also wanted to re-assert itself as an imperialist power. In 1992 it exploited national tensions to re-establish military outposts in Georgia and Moldova.
In December that year Russian troops assisted North Ossetian gangs in ethnically cleansing 70,000 Ingushis—close neighbours of the Chechens—from their homes.
The Ingushis had, like the Chechens, been deported by Stalin in 1944.
The scene was set for a full-scale invasion of Chechnya. But the Kremlin made a spectacular miscalculation.
Expecting to seize Grozny in hours, instead it met mass resistance. The first tank column that entered Grozny was wiped out.
Eighteen months later the Chechens retook Grozny from the Russian army.
The war had become deeply unpopular with ordinary Russians and the Kremlin sued for peace.
The tiny Chechen nation had won a staggering victory—at a huge cost.
Russia’s rulers never stopped looking for a chance to retake Chechnya.
It came in 1999 with NATO’s bombing of Serbia. The West’s attack on Russia’s “Slav brothers” was a gift to the Kremlin, which whipped up a storm of indignation.
Nationalist fever gripped the population, which was itself despairing after eight years of disastrous market reforms.
A series of suspicious explosions in Moscow that autumn were blamed on Chechens—although the real culprits have never been found.
Russia, now led by current president Vladimir Putin launched another bloody assault on Chechnya.
The consequences of this new occupation for the Chechen population beggar belief.
In June Amnesty International talked of “rampant human rights abuses” by Russian troops.
Arbitrary detentions, murder, robbery, rape, torture and disappearances have left no Chechan family unscathed.
Tens of thousands barely survive in abandoned refugee camps.
Many young people know nothing but despair, all hope has been abandoned.
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10/01/06 09:22 PM
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the chechens were a cristian people, similar to the russians and georgians before the ottomans had invaded the region for a breef amount of time. the ottomans force converted the chechens as well as the ossetians and so forth to islam,like they did in albania. when the turks retreated, these new muslim nations had to cling to an identity, that would unite them, and this was islam against russian cristians. islam became chechnias national identity, nation and its cause for secession.
this unrest ceassed for a while when staline deported most of the chechens to siberia and khazakstan. after the soviet union, many returned to their homeland, and this explains why the war has started again. both russians and chechens have commited attrocities to each other and the tensions keep growing.
and islam is evil, but that does not mean that every muslim is a terrorist ( or does it? lol) but the point is that chechens were not always terrorits. the russians havn't exactly been very nice to them over the years...i ccan't really see a clear solution in this conflic exept to give chechens more autonomy or convert them to cristianity...
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10/07/06 07:38 PM
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insulting religion is again a question of opinion..but, thats right, i forgot you lived in faschoislamist turkey, and you don't understand the concept of freedom of speach....
so i will remind you that you once said that you support genocide...and that is an insult to humanity...let alone religion...
on countless occasions, you insulted the Assyrians, greeks and armenians for being cristian..often directly, but also inderectly...and if i was to act like you...i would simply take anything everyone says as a threat to my religion..and then complain about it on a forum...
now let me repeat again what i said..mMY VIEW, is that islam is bad...then i said that not every muslim is a bad person because he follows islam...
so how about you stop acting like a little girl who just got out of a cat fight...and say something intelligent for a change..
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10/10/06 06:26 PM
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QUOTE(Hosank @ 10/09/06 07:59 PM) [snapback]94627[/snapback]
FIRST OF ALL..IF YOU HAD READ ANY OF MY POSTS ON THIS THREAD, YOU WOULD HAVE NOTICED THAT I HAVE NEVER EVEN SPOKEN OF ARMENIAN GENOCIDE OR TURKEY IN ANY WAY AND THE ONLY ONE HERE WHO HAS BEEN BRINGING THAT UP IS YOU FOR THE PAST 3 CONSECUTIVE POSTS....
SECOND...I KNOW TONES OF MUSLIMS WHO HATE BOTH JEWS AND CRISTIANS..JUST LOOK AT THE PRESIDENT OF IRAN, BENLADEN, HAZBOLLAH, SHOULD I GO ON?
NEXT..I READ THE KORAN..AND IT CLEARLY STATES THAT CRISTIANS AND JEWS ARE HEETHENS..AND THAT MUSLIMS ARE SUPERIOR...
AND DON'T TELL ME THAT MUSLIMS RESPECT OTHER RELIGIONS MY FRIEND...
Firstly ; i apologize, may be i 'm confused about some other topics Secondly ; you are illustrating your ideas with EXTREME groups i think ; Iran > governed by Mullahs whose each word is a law ; such that they are anti-secularist and non-democrats . ( We can't discuss about a republician - revolutionary thought when such A person exists who had felt the surpression of religious authority, upon others ) Supports PKK ... Hezbollah > Entraped and convicted with serial-murders of intellectuals . Huge operations are commenced on them . ( They were illegally fighting in the cover of civilian ) Al Queda ; bombed Embassy of England , 4 of Synagogues , HSBC bank where the Turkish capitals are saved Turks suffered from THOSE which you've shown as example . ( Incorrect ) At least, I'm not one of non-Muslim Haters ; whom you even lifted to detect their weights . Thirdly ; I 'm not about to discuss about Christian rituals and put some comments on them . 'cuz i respect to yours . HEETHENS : People whose worship is based upon human-made sculptures , pictures , iconas , fresques . And Are not both Christianity and Judaism do that ? Religionlessness is not my view , just concentrate , what you do in church . And Please read the Ayadh ROMANs ( Byzantine ) from www.kuranikerim.com of English version . - Christians ( monotheists ) are told to beat the Iranians ( polytheist or sth. like that ) as Prophet predicted before .
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11/12/06 09:01 AM
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QUOTE(AssyrianKing19 @ 09/06/06 04:29 PM) [snapback]91014[/snapback]
No Russia give them rights, land, and goverment over that land. And what thanks do they got? A school full of kids and women gets blow up. chechnya cant beat the Russians so they blow up a school.
Sorry... but when did the Russians do that... give them their own land... that was kind of them...  The Russians invaded the area... brutalised the people.. and they wonder why they become terrorists.... By the way... Christianity has an even more bloody history than Islam... QUOTE(Mordoth @ 10/06/06 08:30 AM) [snapback]94315[/snapback]
Chechens were always fought wif russians , and the thread which implies that All muslims are devils which believe in an evilish type of Religious Theology . That is unacceptable , and i did not expect such words from a reasonable user .
I 'm sorry in the name of You .
What about millions of People who are converted to Islam ? Were they so good and preffered to be with Devil ?
Mordoth... What do you mean... stop complaining about sterotyping people... you are the biggest racist on this site....
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11/12/06 11:55 AM
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QUOTE(kurdistani @ 11/12/06 04:01 PM) [snapback]98089[/snapback] Sorry... but when did the Russians do that... give them their own land... that was kind of them... The Russians invaded the area... brutalised the people.. and they wonder why they become terrorists.... By the way... Christianity has an even more bloody history than Islam... Mordoth... What do you mean... stop complaining about sterotyping people... you are the biggest racist on this site.... So, anybody have a solution? Amazing how much hate and misunderstanding between religions causes evil in this world. Maybe it is religion that is evil?
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11/13/06 02:03 AM
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QUOTE(Mordoth @ 11/12/06 09:39 PM) [snapback]98102[/snapback]
No way out , Erik .
Russia shall evacuate the region . That is the unique solution .
Do you think that is realisitic? I mean, the Russians killed more Chechens in a week than Israel has Arabs in 50 years? The Chechens undoubtedly deserve a state of their own, but it doesn't appear that they are going to get it through force, or taking schoolchildren hostage. Are the Russians willing to talk about it? If not, is there some way, short of killing to get them to do so? Perhaps the Chechens should hire some of the same PR people the Palestinians use. Maybe, then, they could get a UN Security Council resolution the next time the Russians flatten an entire Chechen city. Of course, the Russians will simply veto it. What to do?
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11/13/06 07:50 PM
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QUOTE(Erik @ 11/13/06 03:03 AM) [snapback]98181[/snapback]
Do you think that is realisitic? I mean, the Russians killed more Chechens in a week than Israel has Arabs in 50 years? The Chechens undoubtedly deserve a state of their own, but it doesn't appear that they are going to get it through force, or taking schoolchildren hostage.
Are the Russians willing to talk about it? If not, is there some way, short of killing to get them to do so? Perhaps the Chechens should hire some of the same PR people the Palestinians use. Maybe, then, they could get a UN Security Council resolution the next time the Russians flatten an entire Chechen city. Of course, the Russians will simply veto it. What to do?
I know it is not for real , but Chechens are fighting against the tyrants . What could they do to introduce their rightful-conflict in their motherlands ? Russia shan't do it , i know . There is no more solution that i realize, because Chechens are fighting for centuries . That is true Erik , i do not confirm such a strike to young Russians that do know nothing about the historical conflict . But just presume ; EVERYDAY IS BESLAN IN CHECHNYA ... I do not think that Russians will come to the International - desk to deal about that . They 'll do what they knows .
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11/14/06 04:33 AM
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QUOTE(Mordoth @ 11/14/06 02:50 AM) [snapback]98235[/snapback]
I know it is not for real , but Chechens are fighting against the tyrants . What could they do to introduce their rightful-conflict in their motherlands ?
Russia shan't do it , i know . There is no more solution that i realize, because Chechens are fighting for centuries .
That is true Erik , i do not confirm such a strike to young Russians that do know nothing about the historical conflict .
But just presume ; EVERYDAY IS BESLAN IN CHECHNYA ...
I do not think that Russians will come to the International - desk to deal about that . They 'll do what they knows .
Of course the Russians will do what they can. They have no desire to give up territory. Neither did the Soviet Union. They did though. Just look at all those former Soviet republics. They would have done the same to them if they could have. Chechnia is just a little more integrated into Russia, so it will take more leverage than say, far away Armenia, used. The Russians can get pretty hard nosed when you start shooting at them, especially when you start murdering their children in cold blood. They might have even had a pretty good shot at neutralizing the Afghan resistance, had we not helped eliminate their air superiority with all those Stingers. Maybe another tactic?
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11/20/06 08:42 PM
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i am half irish half armenian, ireland is free from england, but armenia has yet to be free from the clutches of turkey
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QUOTE(Mordoth @ 11/14/06 01:50 AM) [snapback]98235[/snapback]
I know it is not for real , but Chechens are fighting against the tyrants . What could they do to introduce their rightful-conflict in their motherlands ?
Russia shan't do it , i know . There is no more solution that i realize, because Chechens are fighting for centuries .
That is true Erik , i do not confirm such a strike to young Russians that do know nothing about the historical conflict .
But just presume ; EVERYDAY IS BESLAN IN CHECHNYA ...
I do not think that Russians will come to the International - desk to deal about that . They 'll do what they knows .
let me answer this question in mordoth language: " the chechens,, living in peace with russians for centuries, have rebelled and become terrorists. they have killed thousands of innocent turks...scratch that...russians, and now cry genocide. we, proud turks...russians, sorry, are now treying to defend our historical homeland that is untouched by conflict, from the hands of these evil chechens." sounds familiar huh mordoth?
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11/24/06 08:48 PM
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QUOTE(kurdistani @ 11/12/06 09:01 AM) [snapback]98089[/snapback] Sorry... but when did the Russians do that... give them their own land... that was kind of them... The Russians invaded the area... brutalised the people.. and they wonder why they become terrorists.... By the way... Christianity has an even more bloody history than Islam... Mordoth... What do you mean... stop complaining about sterotyping people... you are the biggest racist on this site.... Thats why they have a regional goverment like you kurds. Also if your right about invading the place isnt that what muslims do. Muslims invaded and kill ones who are not like them but there are not any Assyrians terrorist why because were are not crazy muslims who terror for not being muslims. Mordoth isnt the biggest racist on this site its you kurds!
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11/27/06 04:34 PM
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hmmm erik....do you have a statue of karl marx in your room next to a greenpeace poster? just asking...
want a solution?...here is one that willnever happen but would be the best solution: move all the chechens out of chechnia
wan't to know how this conflict sarted?...one word: turks. chechens are tatars, they immigrated there through a long route of pillage, rape and destruction. is it a coincidence that all the people on this topic defending chechnia are turks??
no, but a better solution would be for russia to grant autonomous status to the chechens. technically, russia has no immediate need for total clamp down control of that area. granted the caucasus are quite important,..oil, trade so on, but that does not mean you have to massacre all the population on the region
chechens have always been a problem. they are fighters and fighters like to fight. they were not radical islamic terrorists from the start though. though there is right in the russian war, it also made the chechens more radical, and made them ask for help from muslim jihadists across the muslim world. that would explain why, against their will, the chechens are becoming more and more Islamic and commit more and more terrorist acts
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06/07/07 11:36 AM
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who are you to suddenly comprehend all the problems of the caucasus and ask for union.
it is your people that exterminated the caucasian albanians (an ancient christian caucasian people, cousins to the armenians) replaced them with azeri turks, it is you who islamised the ossetians, and perverted the chechens with muslim turks. the only reason why there is a problem in the caucasus is because of your turkish presence.
how do you expect the finally independent and ancient nations of georgia and armenia, to suddenly give up their sovereignty and join up with mortal enemies such as azerbaijan, or chechnia..?
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06/10/07 07:22 PM
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QUOTE(Hosank @ 06/07/07 11:36 AM) [snapback]111028[/snapback] who are you to suddenly comprehend all the problems of the caucasus and ask for union. The truth of who I am will only result in complete hysteria and a complete demeanor of my own appeal on this forum. But I'll give you a hint. I was at one time a man beyond all words. QUOTE it is your people that exterminated the caucasian albanians My people were Russian Serfs. We had nothing to do with whole slaughter. QUOTE (an ancient christian caucasian people, cousins to the armenians) replaced them with azeri turks, it is you who islamised the ossetians, and perverted the chechens with muslim turks. the only reason why there is a problem in the caucasus is because of your turkish presence. I'm not Turkish. I'm 1/8 Russian, 3/8 Polish, 1/8 English, 3/32 Spanish, 1/32 Gypsie, 1/32 Irish, 1/32 Scottish, 1/16 Cherokee, 1/16 German, and 1/16 French. I'm a descendent of English and Spanish Royalty. I'm a descendent of Russian and Polish serfdom. I'm a descedent of German and French Knights. I'm a descendent of Scottish and Irish Nobility. I'm a descendent of Cherokee Witchdoctors. I'm a descendent of a noble Gypsy family that had lived in Spain and intermarried with Spanish Royalty. My grandma Amy who is where I get my English, Spanish, and Gypsie blood came from an extremely wealthy family that lost their entire wealth during the Great Depression. It is funny that she is considered hispanic, since she was born in Canada. I'm related to Stanton Friedman and many professors that live in Europe, perhaps some that you have encountered. QUOTE how do you expect the finally independent and ancient nations of georgia and armenia, to suddenly give up their sovereignty and join up with mortal enemies such as azerbaijan, or chechnia..? Azerbaijan and Armenia will join Kurdistan, Assyria, Zazaistan, and Turkmenli in their own Federation of Subar. Georgia and other Caucasian States which exist in Russia will join in establishing Caucasia. How do I expect to accomplish to do this. Well I don't really have to do anything. After 2012, everything that needs to be done will already be done. All I have to do is be on my terms with "God" before this event shall occur.
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06/10/07 11:20 PM
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have you not learned anything on this forum about armenians? do you not understand that we have, for centuries fought for our land, and now we have a tiny portion of it left....and now you want to simply make it dissapear? join with those who tried to bring it's downfall? btw, were were already 2 transcaucasian republics, and both of them failed. QUOTE My people were Russian Serfs. We had nothing to do with whole slaughter. yah, sorry about that, i wasn't talking about you in particular..
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06/11/07 04:26 PM
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QUOTE(Hosank @ 06/10/07 11:20 PM) [snapback]111320[/snapback] have you not learned anything on this forum about armenians?
do you not understand that we have, for centuries fought for our land, and now we have a tiny portion of it left....and now you want to simply make it dissapear? join with those who tried to bring it's downfall?
btw, were were already 2 transcaucasian republics, and both of them failed.
yah, sorry about that, i wasn't talking about you in particular.. You have an anger management problem. And Armenia won't disappear. I'm a big advocator on cultural conservation. You can just call Subar, Great Armenia if it will make you feel better about it.
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06/12/07 04:15 PM
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QUOTE(Hosank @ 06/11/07 06:06 PM) [snapback]111476[/snapback] do you know what a federation is??? Well I live in one unlike you, so I'm assuming that I do. LOL! QUOTE you are planning to place armenia in a federation with kurdistan, how the hell will it not dissapear as a country? In the same sense of mind that it was a kingdom within an empire of which you had called a country. QUOTE(Hosank @ 06/11/07 01:55 PM) [snapback]111409[/snapback] see, during the byzantine empire, there was such a thing as a country of armenia, with it's own kings, princes, armies, nobilities and so on... An empire is almost always a monarchy of one state holding power over another. QUOTE Generally, they may define an empire as a state that extends dominion over populations distinct culturally and ethnically from the culture/ethnicity at the center of power. A federation is a group of states that hold equal power over the entire dominion. QUOTE ah, so obviously, to the person that does not have a country, patriotism is a synonym of anger management problem eh? No. But your attitude reaks.
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Chechens suffered a lot , but they never gave up and i'M SURE they never will, that's a spirit, they are as you said Baku, the real warriors. Their women, children fight together against Russians. That is what I call a NATION.
