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Pomak Turks of Bati Trakya
BIGTURK
post 10/08/05 09:24 AM
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POMAK TURKS


1. INTRODUCTION:


Pomak Turks, an inseperable part of Turks, mostly live in Bulgaria and some of them live in the "forbidden zone" on Rodop Mountains in West Thrace.

Pomak Turks, whom Bulgarians wanted to assimilate by massacres are face to face with the same plans of Greeks in Western Thrace since 1960.

In the Balkans especially between 1877-78, this Turkish tribe experienced severe cruelity by Russians and Bulgarians. They are the dynamic factor of the Turkish minority in Bulgaria and West Thrace.

2. HISTORY :

a. Thrace:

Thrace which takes its name from its first inhabitants Thracs have been a scene for important wars and developments in the history. The struggle between Tracs, who came from North to the region in 2000 B.C., and Persians , Macedons, Romans and Greeks had continued for a long time.

In Thrace, in III. century when obligatory christianism had begun and IV. century when Got attacks had begun, Hun Turks and in V. century Avar and Bulgarian Turks emerged as dynamic powers in the region. The state which is known as "Tuna Bulgarian State" in the history ended in the year 864 as the leader of Bulgarian Turks, Bogoris Han accepted officially to be an Ortodox.

The efforts to settle in the Balkans started in the beginning of 860s with the migration of Peçenek, Uz(Oğuz) and Kuman-Kıpçak and continued until XI. century. History puts it forward that the Turks were the dominant people in the Thrace, Balkans, Macadonia and Doburca aftr V. century. (1)

During the sovereignity of Byzantians, Aydınoğlu Umur Bey helped the Byzantians to resolve the conflicts for the throne. This formed the essential base for Ottoman sovereignity in the region.

Ottoman Turks started to conquer Balkans in 1360s and their sovereignity lasted in the region until the begining of the 20. century.

b. Pomak Turks :

Bulgarians claim that Pomak Turks are "Moslem Bulgarians" and Greeks claim that they are "Moslem Greeks", actually they are from the Kuman-Kıpçak Turkish Tribe who came from North to the region. (2)

They could not been destroyed although they had fell into soverignity of Bulgarians and Byzantians for a while.


The name "Pomak" means "the helper" and was given by Slavs to this tribe.

Bulgarians used the name insultingly to mean "the helper of Ottomans"


According to Greeks, Pomaks are the sons of Alexander the Great and had been forced to become Moslems by Greeks. These arguments are far from reality.

Interstingly the name "Pomak" was extensivley used in XIX. century at the same time with the emergence of the term "Kurd" and "Armenian Problem". This was not a coinicidence, but used deliberatley to seperate Turkish Nation and Ottoman Empire..


c. Western Thrace :

As Ottoman Sovereignity started in the Balkans, Kuman and Peçenek Turks had become Moslem and taken important official positions in the frontiers.

Western Thrace is a region full of mountains.It consists of Dedeağaç, Gümülcine, İskeçe and is approximately 8578 square kilometers.

The pitiful developments in Western Thrace had started especially in 1877-78 Ottoman-Russian war. As Ottoman was defeated in the war, new states bearing the name "Turk" emerged in the region although they lasted only for a short while.The most important of these is "Western Thrace Turkish Republic". During the foundation of these states Pomak Turks had very important contributions and helps. This shows their acceptance of liberty as their ancestors Pecenek and Kuman Turks.

Pomaks helped Ottomans to stop the rebellions in the region, and hence given the name "Pomak" which means the "Helper"


After The World War I, and Balkan Wars, Bulgarians had soverignity in the regions where Pomaks live with Bucharest Treaty. pomak Turks preserved their culture despite the pressure of Bulgarians until 1919. Allied Forces took the region from Bulgarians by Neully Treaty in 1919 and then gave it to Greece with Sevr treaty in 1920.


After the victory in Independence War under the leadership of Mustafa Kemal, The minority rights of Pomak Turks had been assured by Lozan Treaty. Pomak Turks actually were not minority in the region but they were dominant both in number and land.

During World War II, Bulgarians tried to assimilate Pomak Turks.

After 1967, the junta of Colonels applied the same assimilation police aginst Turks. This policy did not change with the civil goverment after 1974.

Greeks argue that there are no Turks in Western Thrace rather there are Helenic Moslems.


Pomaks in Greece especially live in Iskece, Gümülcine and Dimetoka. Pomaks have a language which contains 60% Turkish words.

According to Ottoman records, the village Sahin is founded by Lala Şahin Paşa. This village is the cultural center of Pomak Turks.


d. Bulgarian and Pomak Turks :

Bulgarians claim that Pomak Turks are Bulgarians using the small differences in their language. They try to show Turkish Population less.l

Their main argument is the language but Pomak language is %30
Ukrain Slav, %25 Kuman-Kıpçak, % 20 Oguz Turkish, % 15 Nogayca ve % 10
Arabian.

After 1877-78 Ottoman-Russian War, Turks were reffered as "Turkish Minority". Between 1950-1965 they were reffered as "Turkish Inhabitants". Between 1965-1976 they were reffered as " Bulgar Citizen with Turkish Background", after 1976 they were reffered as "Bulgarian Turks". After 1984 the name "Turk" is totally eleminated and they are referred as "Moslem Bulgarians".

(1) Operations against Turks during the Balkan Wars:


The Bulgarian Goverment wanted to eleminate Turkish presence and they thought thjat it would be easier to do this by seperating the Turkish Public. They started with the propoganda of saying that Pomaks were not Turks.

During Balkan Wars, Bulgarian General Sarafof had ordered to make all the Turks in the macadonia and Rodops Bulgarian and to kill the ones who had refused. This order had been executed by

a. Forcing Turks to become Christians
b. Changing their names with Bulgarian names
c. To destroy Turkish-Islamic Culture and Civilization.
d. Turkish genocides.



Mustafa Kemal had notified the Bulgarian Goverment to stop these actions in 1914 and had positive results.

However, Turks were forced to leave their lands but most of them resisted to change land. Until 1950 no serios migration to Turkey took place.

(2) Operations After 1945


After 1945, genocide aginst Moslem Turks had continued. All of the Turks had been force to change their names. With the decesions in 1948,1951, 1964, 1969 operations to create a "Bulgarian-Slav" Public had continued.

In the campaign of Assimilation to make Bulgarians between 1968-1972, same operations had been performed in all the regions. The following operations were made:


a.All of the applications to change name and nation were mass printed.
b.Dates were writtend elibrately old.
c.100 Leva was collected from the Turks for expenses.
d.Torture was applied to the ones who refused to change nation and name.


Thousands had been killed since they did not accepted to chage nation and religion. A public grave containing 1000 dead bodies was found in Meric Dam. Between 1968-1972 , 8-10.000 Turk were killed.
558.325 Moslem Turks were forced to change name and 48073 people wwere fired since they did not change names. These operations have continued after 1984.


3. SOCIAL-CULTURAL STRUCTURE OF POMAK TURKS :

Birth has an important place in Pomaks as in all other Turkish Tribes. Mother stays home for 40 days to protect her child from evil eyes. On the 40th day, the mother and the child take a bath and go out. This is an important Turkish tradition.

The age for marriage is between 17-22 for boys and 17 for girls. They do not marry their relatives. Single marriage is a principle.

They speak a Turkish dialect called "Pomakca". They can also speak Modern Turkish and Greek if obligatory.

4. CONCLUSION :

The efforts to assimilate Pomak Turks by Greece and Bulgaria as a result of their policy of applying pressure on minorities, still continues.


Greece tries to show Pomaks as Slavs and to change their language and culture in their own interest to cut their relationship between Bulgarian Goverment tries to prevent the Pomak children from taking Turkish Language Courses.


Bulgarian Turks are under the influence of several Christian Missionaires after 1990. Bulgarian Goverment shows special interest on the subject for Pomak turks and Moslem Gipsies.

A book named " Moslem People in the Balkans and Bulgaria" is published in 1997. This book shows proofs that that the Bulgarian claim that Pomaks are Bulgarians who had been forced to become moslem,is not true.

Greece has operations to destroy the unity of Turkish Minority in Wetern Thrace. They always refer to Turkish minority as "Moslem Minority". Their military officals declare that they work on the Pomak culture and try to show Pomak Culture seperate from Turkish culture.


There is a web site which contains information to assure that Pomaks are Greek origin. This site is prepared by Greek Secret Service.

Both Greeks and Bulgarians try to create artificially a Pomak Nation witha differetn culture and language. They do not want to accept them as Turks.

Especially after 1950, many Pomaks migrated to Turkey. 23,000 of the Turks who came from Turkey from Bulgaria are Pomaks and they live in Çanakkale, Edirne, Eskişehir, Bursa and Balıkesir.

http://www.turkses.com/culture/Pomak_eng/p...pomak_genis.htm
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Tangriberdi
post 08/19/07 05:10 AM
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Sorry to say. But Pomaks are not Turks. They are just Muslim Bulgars. Due to religious affinity, they may feel close to Turks. But. That is the fact. They are not Turks.
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Hosank
post 08/19/07 08:27 PM
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somewhat like northern azeris who do not feel as part of the turkic world, though they are muslim and speak turkish
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Tangriberdi
post 08/20/07 10:58 AM
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QUOTE(Hosank @ 08/19/07 08:27 PM) [snapback]115409[/snapback]
somewhat like northern azeris who do not feel as part of the turkic world, though they are muslim and speak turkish
You are just a provocator in that forum, in my opinion. I have many Azerbaijani friends who proudly says they are just Turks. I prefer their word to the word of an Armanian full of hatred towards Turks. Sorry, your comment is not valid to interprete and valuable for me to think more about it.
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Hosank
post 08/20/07 11:46 AM
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to be honest, it suits me better aswell to simply claim that all azeris are turks right? makes one enemy, one hated enemy on both sides. unfortunately, it appears, (and i have found out, from azeris) that all azeris are not necessarely turks. infact, another azeri told me, though i doubt it, that historians believe azeris have only been influenced (language and culture) by turks, and not ethnically. of course, i do not believe that too be true.
but put it this way, i as an armenian, gain nothing from claiming they are not turks, infact, i lose, by saying that we are in a war with people, who are at least parcially related to us.
just like more then half of modern turks of turkey today arn't even turkish.
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Tangriberdi
post 08/20/07 12:40 PM
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QUOTE(Hosank @ 08/20/07 11:46 AM) [snapback]115421[/snapback]
to be honest, it suits me better aswell to simply claim that all azeris are turks right? makes one enemy, one hated enemy on both sides. unfortunately, it appears, (and i have found out, from azeris) that all azeris are not necessarely turks. infact, another azeri told me, though i doubt it, that historians believe azeris have only been influenced (language and culture) by turks, and not ethnically. of course, i do not believe that too be true.
but put it this way, i as an armenian, gain nothing from claiming they are not turks, infact, i lose, by saying that we are in a war with people, who are at least parcially related to us.
just like more then half of modern turks of turkey today arn't even turkish.

To be honest. As an Armenian ? No that is impossible. You have been in America or Europe for generations. You have no idea about even your own people. You were grown up with hostile feelings towards us. with stories of wars and enmity., with the tales of massacres committed by Turks who are inhuman aliens. If you want to be really honest, confess that truth.
No it does not suits to you as you claim. When morsels are smaller it is easier to swallow. Isn't it.
That is the usual divide and conquer policy which is practiced on us by your Western bosses for centuries. And now if you learn these ridiculous logic games from them, you should find or write more credible and believable stories. If you are surrounded by only one big enourmous huge enemy, you are a morsel. But, if you can sow the seeds of separation amongst the co munities of your integrated enemy and divide them, and turn them into smaller individual entities, it is easier to cope with.
Youy can never deny that fact.
Of course all Azerbaijanis are not necessarily Turks. There are many talysh, lezgi, udin, tat, Kurd and many more in Northern Azerbaijan . But Those who are offically categorized as Azerbaijani ecluding aforementioned ethnic entities are just Turks. That makes at least 80% of today-Azerbaijan. Probably the Azerbaijani Turk-pretending Azerbaijanis who misinformed you are of those I meantioned. You can never openone more hole at the wall of brotherhood of Azerbaijani Turks and Anatolian Turks. We are the exactly same people, separated first by sectarian conflicts of the early ages, second by those enemies who made use of conflicts between us, third by invasions and occupations by aforesaid enemies. But all that time has passed, all what happened never changed the sense of oneness and sameness. And your trivial and worthless words will not change it either.
Those historians? Who are they? Let me tell you. Those funded by the West. Iran, Russia, Armenia, China....
We Turks challenged 7 most powerful states of the time before our independence war. Our challnge changed something. It changed the nations hopes to exist. What Turks started is the will for independence.
Now the same 7 or more but the exactly same source of evil, says us we are not us.
Go off. It is none of your business to decide who is who.
Let us free, let us alone , let us independent todecide who we are . Until we discover our identity. And then what leaks from the dead body of the past will tell you who we are.
I say WE. Not they or only I. I say we. You understand me. I say a Turk is a Turk. And If someone is a Turk , he knows it. He cannot be learnt. He knows it. Those who does not know, or does not want to know his Turkness is free from Turkness. And we do not need his Turkness. The Turks left is enough for us.

Let me tell you , you Armenians are only linguistically Armenians. Nothing else but a mixture of Persians Georgians Turks and Arabs and Assyrians who adopted a Hay language.
Does it sound good? Huh?
I am sure it sounds good.

You wil never understand. Our Turkishness does not come from our blood and genes. Our Turkishness comes from our heart.
Being a Turk means to have power in heart to say I' m a Turk.
As long as you miserable so called genocide-obsessed Armenians claim we are not Turks, we get rid of any bit of doubt. And we become more and more and more and more and more proud of our Turkicness.
Our pride is your misery. That is enough for you.
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Hosank
post 08/22/07 10:18 AM
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forgetting, for a second, that your comment is totally beside the point,..
i will also mention that you have several contradictions within your rediculous post.

here is a very obvious one.
you said that turks are not turk by their genes, but are turk by their heart, then you said armenians are not really armenian, and are infact a mix of turks and persians. so basically is it our heart or our genes that make us who we are? you should figure that out before you post stupidities.

second, i am blond, light skinned and light eyed, when you show me a turk, from your beloved turran who has my complection, do tell me, because untill then i will highly doubt my turkishness. we have been invaded, yes, but that does not mean we are not armenian.

what are you saying? that turkey doesn't fund historians? turkey does not lobby? turkey is a victim?

QUOTE
Let us free, let us alone , let us independent todecide who we are . Until we discover our identity.

i don't get it, you keep saying random things, most of which are totally controversial to your point of view..leave you alone? and i thought you had already discovered that you are a pure turk, and bla bla?...guess you don't know your own identity to beggin with.

QUOTE
Of course all Azerbaijanis are not necessarily Turks. There are many talysh, lezgi, udin, tat, Kurd and many more in Northern Azerbaijan . But Those who are offically categorized as Azerbaijani ecluding aforementioned ethnic entities are just Turks

though i agree with you that to be an azeri, you should be a turk, it appears that many people who use the term 'azeri' to describe themselves reject the term 'turk' most likely, though many turks have been involved in the formation of the azeri nation, other peoples have been converted as 'turk' without necessarely being genetically turkish. just like in eastern turkey, where you will find alot of 'turks' who aer not turkish at all..

QUOTE
No it does not suits to you as you claim. When morsels are smaller it is easier to swallow. Isn't it.

i really disagree, it is much easier to galvanise a people when forced to fight one foe, as opposed to many others with no relations what so ever.

the rest of what you said doesn't even make sense, for example 'the turkish will for independence' independence from who? the greeks and armenians you inslaved? get real.

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post 08/23/07 01:26 AM
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I see a general problem here in these forums.

Almost everybody tells to other debaters that they are not actually who they believe to be. This is BS and irrelevant.

If Hosank is not an ermeni or I am not a Turk or Diri is not a kurd etc why the debate?

Also the personal attacks is pretty boring, I used to get pissed at them now I feel that the quality of the debate is hitting the bottom.

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Hosank
post 09/03/07 09:35 PM
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QUOTE
If Hosank is not an ermeni or I am not a Turk or Diri is not a kurd etc why the debate?

agreed

QUOTE
Also the personal attacks is pretty boring, I used to get pissed at them now I feel that the quality of the debate is hitting the bottom.

interesting, because lately, it has been you bringing the personal attacks, and this page has not seen any of this sort so far...
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post 09/13/07 07:40 AM
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QUOTE(Hosank @ 09/04/07 06:35 AM) [snapback]115975[/snapback]
agreed
interesting, because lately, it has been you bringing the personal attacks, and this page has not seen any of this sort so far...



Really ??

Please feel free to quote me insulting anyone around here or using a racist remark, or calling names.

Thank you on advance.
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irlandahay
post 09/19/07 05:35 PM
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i am half irish half armenian, ireland is free from england, but armenia has yet to be free from the clutches of turkey



QUOTE(arrow @ 09/13/07 01:40 PM) [snapback]116228[/snapback]
Really ??

Please feel free to quote me insulting anyone around here or using a racist remark, or calling names.

Thank you on advance.


is that the only thing you know how to blurt out?

how many times has hosank shown you?

as for me, I think you deserve the personal insults because of your ignorance. I believe Ignorance is a problem that can be solved, stupid people are born that way and stay that way, ignorant people have the means, the opportunity and (except in your case) the will to change that. so do us all a favor and do a bit of research before you begin posting!


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eren berke
post 02/05/08 11:56 PM
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QUOTE(Hosank @ 08/22/07 10:18 AM) [snapback]115491[/snapback]
forgetting, for a second, that your comment is totally beside the point,..
i will also mention that you have several contradictions within your rediculous post.


I'll point outsomething really ridiculous. An inability to spell 'ridiculous'. That's just one. But hey, its not like you grew up in English speaking country, right?
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KHAZARI
post 02/06/08 06:01 AM
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QUOTE(irlandahay @ 09/19/07 05:35 PM) [snapback]116468[/snapback]
is that the only thing you know how to blurt out?

how many times has hosank shown you?

as for me, I think you deserve the personal insults because of your ignorance. I believe Ignorance is a problem that can be solved, stupid people are born that way and stay that way, ignorant people have the means, the opportunity and (except in your case) the will to change that. so do us all a favor and do a bit of research before you begin posting!



YOU WELCOME TO THE FORUM ARKADAS icon_smile.gif
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Hosank
post 06/20/08 12:22 AM
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QUOTE
I'll point outsomething really ridiculous. An inability to spell 'ridiculous'. That's just one. But hey, its not like you grew up in English speaking country, right?

actually, to be honest, i didn't even write that post, my brother used my acount by accident.icon_wink.gif
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