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Turan
Hosank
post 05/02/07 10:42 AM
Post #51


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Conflict/Cultural/Country Interest: armenia, turkey, azerbaijan, mostly, ...christian lebanon...



arsen
that picture is probably genuine (though obviously found on tallarmeniantale.com) there were armenian volonteers in the armenian legion. they were known to be honourable fighters, and saved many soviet prisoners, as well as jews.

i find it ironic, and illogical, however that turks keep accusing the entire armenian nation, from canada to australia, of collaboration with nazi germany, since i mean...IT'S TURKEY WE ARE SPEAKING OF.

yes, certain individual armenians joined the german (not nazi) army in ww2 with the goal of liberating the fatherland from bolchevism.

however, the STATE of turkey activelly collaborated with Hitlerian Germany, and was about to enter the war on germany's side.
turkey had massed hundreds of thousands of troops on the border with soviet armenia in 1942, when the germany army group south began it's push into the caucasus. they withdrawed from the invasion only when germany lost at stalingrad.
but continued to supply germany with natural resources, and trade, till in the last week of the war, they betrayed their ally in pure turkish fashion, and declared war on germany.

there was also an azerbaijani legion attached to the german army in ww2, and many turkish volonteers. so before you try accusing armenians of being fanatical national socialists, think alittle.

QUOTE
Claiming the lands of Turks is one of Armenian extremism .


sitting on armenian land, after having murdered it's armenian inhabitants is worse then extremism
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Tangriberdi
post 02/15/09 02:22 AM
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Deleted and rewritten below
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Tangriberdi
post 06/04/10 02:36 PM
Post #53


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QUOTE (Dīrī @ 01/23/06 11:47 AM) *
See? This is just sick... This is what Kurds are angry about in North Kurdistan and in Turkey... Turks TAKE everything KURDISH and claim it as "Turkish"... There is nothing Turkish about the Shelwar, the Govend or about the Duhol ū Zurna played to it...


Take everything Kurdish? Is there anything Kurdish?
Halay which you call govend is a Turkic word which derives from the word Alay ( mening crowd, troop) and is used to refer to the dance because it is played in multitude. Halay or Govend as you call does not necessarily belong only one people. This dance is shared by Turks Kurds and Arabs, with varying forms and versions, played in some different forms by all three peoples. Most probably Turks adopted it from the locals, but these locals ( natives of anatolia) were definitely not Kurds. Every honest and scientifically motivated person knows that Kurdish existence in Anatolia is as recent as Turkish existence in Anatolia. Kurdish culture is essentially Iranic and many Anatolian cultural elements were also adopted by Kurds by time in which they spread northwards and westwards since 1600s' Turco-Iranian war of Chaldiran-times of Yavuz Sultan Selim and Shah Ismail.
Shalvār is not something entirely Kurdish, it is totally Iranic. Turks adopted it during their migration to Anatolia through Iran. Davul (Duhol) and Zurna (Surnāy) are also probably Iranic and shared by Turks Kurds Arabas and Iranians.
Now, can you see anything Kurdish? Perhaps Turks took things and adopted them into Turkish culture, which is something very normal, and not something to worry about. Also, Kurds are not so different from Turks about adopting things.

What's more... a bare fact... There were hundred thousands of tents of nomadic Turkmens living in Eastern and South-Eastern Anatolian regions in Turkey since the times of Turkmen Beyliks such as Ahlatsahids, Artukids, Saltukids, Inalids, Mengujids, Arbilids and since the times of big Turkic states like Karakoyunlus, Akkoyunlus and Turko-Mongolian state Ilkhanids. What happened to so big crowds of Turks in the region? Let me tell you : with the mistaken policies of Ottoman state, most of them were Kurdicized...intermingled with Kurds and absorbed by Kurdish mainstream, Kurds were not actually majority in the region though. Did Kurds not adopt any Turkic cultural elements from these Turks? not any? Isn't there any Turkic blood flowing through Kurdish veins? How many Turks are left without being assimilated by Kurds in the region?
Are the Culture of Turkish population still inhabiting eastern and Southeastern Anatolia and and the culture of Kurds surrounding these Turks so diferent? Is not there any interaction between these societies, Has not ever been? Or they all intermingled and mixed?

A very tiny reminder: It is told that half of Kurds living in Turkey are descendants of Kurdicized Turks, and there are lots of, tons of evidence that shows that it is highly possible to be the truth about Kurds in Turkey.
Take care my brother.
Now, Is there anything Kurdish?
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